Recession Proof Your Business: How to Keep Growing No Matter the Economy [Endless Customers Podcast Ep. 79]

This transcript has been generated by AI and not checked for accuracy.

Tom DiScipio
0:00:00
So, of all your internal leadership discussions, if the economy has been at the top of the list for those discussions, trust me, you're not alone. A lot of folks that I'm talking with now are experiencing the same thing, plus the fear and uncertainty of going into the next economy in 2025. So if that's also at the top of your list, stay tuned.

Alex Winter
0:00:23
Welcome back to Endless Customers.

Alex Winter
0:00:33
I'm your host, Alex Winter, and today we are joined by Tom DeCipio. He's a managing partner here at Impact. He's also a client advisor and a friend. Tom, welcome back to the show. Yeah, thanks for having me. Good to be back at the roundtable.

Alex Winter
0:00:42
Thanks for being here. Yes, it's always great having you at the roundtable, and you're the perfect person for this discussion because today we're talking about something that's high level, something that business owners need to be thinking about. And if they're not, maybe they're struggling trying to find the balance within this of,

Alex Winter
0:00:57
how do you manage your business? And also keep your eye on the economy and economic things that affect your business. Obviously, we just came out of an election, but also thinking about COVID and just different pullbacks and things that we've experienced

Alex Winter
0:01:11
over the last five years or so. What should business owners be really thinking about going into 2025? Yeah, well, you know, even before we get there, I can kind of share what I'm hearing from business owners and the conversations I'm having week over week. Yeah. You know, everybody's heard the term, the post COVID economy, if you will.

Tom DiScipio
0:01:28
Right. And in so many of these conversations, I'm hearing company owners and business leaders saying like, oh man, we were, you know, like, as COVID was coming to an end, we started, our business was thriving, we were up 30, 40, 50%. And now we're back down to like pre COVID levels. I've heard that too. There's been that like dip up of like surge of business because of COVID. And now it seems to be, I wouldn't say dipping, but it's almost got reset back to where it was pre-COVID and pre-the explosion that occurred. Yeah, yeah. And so these business owners are like, well, we've staffed up, we've prepared for this level of growth,

Tom DiScipio
0:02:14
and the growth has subsided a bit. And so we need to start generating growth again organically, because it's not necessarily happening as a result of just the normal day-to-day economy. And so they've experienced what I would call like a pullback, right? So if you think as an investor in the stock market, a lot of times, you know, if a stock makes a huge move upwards. A nice bullish run to the upside.

Tom DiScipio
0:02:47
Yeah, like a nice parabolic run up, a lot of times following that run up, you have a pretty significant pullback. And so while folks have experienced those gains, a lot of times those gains will come back but they'll be at a somewhat higher level than when you originally started. And that's where a lot of these CEOs and business leaders I'm talking to are feeling like they're at.

Tom DiScipio
0:03:11
Like they've made gains but it's pulled back significantly. And so how can I rev this up again? Yeah, it's like retesting that bottom trend line and it's like how do you make sure it doesn't dip past that trend line and continue, even though it might pull back a bit,

Tom DiScipio
0:03:24
it's still trending in the right direction

Tom DiScipio
0:03:25
up and to the right.

Alex Winter
0:03:27
Yeah.

Tom DiScipio
0:03:27
Yeah.

Alex Winter
0:03:28
So how do business owners do that, right? So you've been hearing this a lot and you're a business owner yourself, so I think this is like a double entendre here of like when you're in those situations, you're starting to have that pullback, that retest, what should you be thinking

Alex Winter
0:03:41
about, what should you be putting into practice to make sure that you don't go back to where you started and you continue to push forward? Yeah, well, not only can it be frustrating to experience that, but as a business owner, it can also kind of create some fear, right? Because you're once riding these highs and things are pulling back and it's like, you know, how far is this gonna go? Yeah, especially if you start to get used to that cashflow

Tom DiScipio
0:04:11
and that money coming in when you're at the top of it, it's easy to get like, wow, this is great and you can almost get comfortable in the sense of like, I love where we're at, I hope it stays like this forever. But the reality is that's not always gonna be true. Right, and so as business owners, I think when things are booming upwards, you most likely lean

Tom DiScipio
0:04:33
maybe more towards risk and innovation and trying new things and investing more, right? Leaning in harder. And during these pullback moments or reset moments, I think business leaders should be thinking more about going back to the fundamentals. Like what are the things that are going to sustain your business for the long term?

Tom DiScipio
0:04:54
And are you still doing those things really well? Managing cash flow, looking at profit, paying more attention to where your investments are going. Are you spending a lot on other tools or softwares or services that maybe you don't need to or you shouldn't? But- Or even employees, I've heard sometimes.

Tom DiScipio
0:05:14
Of course, of course, even employees. But it's in my mind during those moments, it forces you to rethink about the fundamentals of business. And is, are you running a healthy company? Yeah, I love that you just said that. It clicked for me when you said it

Tom DiScipio
0:05:28
because when you have cash positive flow happening, when you're in a good spot like that and you're on that uptrend, it gives you the leverage to experiment, to take risks, to try things that you wouldn't normally be able to do if you didn't have the

Tom DiScipio
0:05:40
funds to do so. But then when there's a pullback, you need to get a little bit more conservative, but not in the sense of like you can't spend money. It's more about being strategic with what you spend it on and what you focus your time on to get back to the fundamentals. And it's true, I think when you're in those moments of experimentation, you almost start to drift a little bit away from the morning huddles, the daily, like the things that you're supposed to be doing

Tom DiScipio
0:06:03
from an accountability standpoint, and then it's really hard to get back into that space again and to get the team and people really having good habits and good behaviors again. Yeah, yeah, and Marcus talked about this in Impact Live and he talks about this a lot,

Tom DiScipio
0:06:17
and we might have talked about this in the last episode we did together, but it's that pride cycle. Things are going really well, it's like, let's experiment, let's invest, let's do things we haven't done before. And you sort of get away

Tom DiScipio
0:06:29
from the natural processes and fundamentals that have gotten to you to where you are. And so, yeah. Alright, so this is a perfect segue, because I feel like we've been hearing a lot of business owners say this at Impact Live and other events and just in conversations about the post COVID boom, where they're starting to see a dip, revenues may be dwindling a little bit, but they're still doing okay, but it's not as good as they were doing.

Tom DiScipio
0:06:55
So they're starting to get that feeling of, I need to do something, something's off, why am I not having the same revenue or cash flow I was having? So it's not like, oh my God, it's dire, this is bad, but it also isn't great, and if you're in business,

Tom DiScipio
0:07:08
you always wanna keep having better profits and better profitability, so what do we say and how do we help businesses that are in that spot? I might be feeling that way. Yeah, they're just feeling like they're not where they want to be. And so some of the things that I've heard in recent conversations has really been around

Tom DiScipio
0:07:24
competition. So in previous versions of our economy, money has been a lot cheaper to get based on interest rates and just risk tolerance of the market. And so during those times, inflation, yeah, and inflation, and during those times, you saw a lot of competition enter the marketplace because they could. And that doesn't mean that, yes, that could mean that new companies get started, but also companies expand their services. And interestingly enough, a lot of the conversations I've been having recently have been with pool building is having a massive pullback and retraction,

Tom DiScipio
0:08:07
partly because of the expense of pools, partly because of how expensive it is to borrow money, but also partly because competition is getting more fierce. And that competition is not unique to just pool building. I mean, that's across the construction world. And the other things that have been challenging has been finding

Tom DiScipio
0:08:28
employees because the job markets have been pretty strong and finding great talent and talent that's expecting more money is becoming very difficult. So there's a number of things that have to get balanced and it's making growth just harder overall to do. Yeah, that makes total sense. It's one of those things where pools are a great example, but there's a lot of home building examples. But I'm also thinking about as a musician, you are too. We love our guitars,

Tom DiScipio
0:08:55
but during COVID you were at home, so you needed to have hobbies and playing guitar was a great hobby. Playing the piano, putting a pool in for the kids so that you don't lose your sanity because everyone's cooped up in the house. Those were all very real things, but guitars were cool and pools were cool before COVID.

Tom DiScipio
0:09:10
So it was almost like COVID created this urgency, but it didn't really change the table stakes that I'm just like the way that you just said that it just got me thinking that like sure now COVID isn't as big of a thing. People can travel, people can go outside now, which is great, but that doesn't mean that they don't want to pull. You just have to maybe reset or reposition how reposition your approach or how you attack that conversation. Is that is that fair to say that? Yeah, it's fair to say that.

Tom DiScipio
0:09:38
And I think it's the desire for the pool or whatever the thing is has not necessarily gone down. It's that the road to getting it has become a lot more difficult. Okay. Because everything's more expensive. Right, because everything you mentioned, right.

Tom DiScipio
0:09:59
It's a little bit more expensive to borrow money and there's a lot more considerations that have to be made before you can make such a significant purchase, even a smaller purchase like a guitar or a pair of shoes or what have you. And so when I have these types of conversations, again, it comes back to the fundamentals of business. So like what are going to be the things that actually help a consumer get past price and a fear of making a decision or The willingness to make a decision and in my mind, that's brand

Tom DiScipio
0:10:29
Definitely people will still remain loyal to the brand despite changes in price or Tolerance or things like that. So as companies, you know look to continue to grow if they're coming up against these pricing conversations or I Don't want to call it nitpicky, just remember that you have a brand and remember

Tom DiScipio
0:10:56
that the more helpful and engaging and customer-centric and supportive your brand is, the more likely you are going to be able to overcome price objections caused by current state of the economy, future state of the economy. Yeah, that's really good advice, really good advice. And it makes sense from a consumer standpoint, just speaking for myself, if I asked somebody,

Tom DiScipio
0:11:21
like, why are the prices so high? Why did this go to where it was at? And they honestly explained to me why, and that their products are still the same, but the cost of manufacturing and shipping and da-da-da, and interest and so on and so on.

Tom DiScipio
0:11:32
If they explained that to me, I would feel much more confident and I'd have more trust in buying from them than somebody who's just like, oh, the prices went up, deal with it. You know, because that does happen.

Tom DiScipio
0:11:42
It happens where people don't really take the time to build the trust, to focus on their brand, like you're saying, and to really do, they ask, you answer in a way that's gonna continue to push and promote confidence in people and in buyer sentiment.

Tom DiScipio
0:11:53
So that's definitely a huge piece that people have to think about. So if you're a business owner, you got all these companies that are clawing at it, there's a bit of a lull happening, what should you do to stand out?

Tom DiScipio
0:12:03
What should you do to try to push yourself ahead a little bit and disrupt or get ahead of the crowd? Yeah, well, this brings to mind to me a quote from Warren Buffett, which I'm going to read because I don't want to butcher it, because it's so awesome.

Tom DiScipio
0:12:16
And the quote is, be fearful when others are greedy and be greedy only when others are fearful. And so for the listeners out there, if you don't know who Warren Buffett is, he's one of the most successful investors in the world and has managed to be successful throughout any economy we've ever had.

Tom DiScipio
0:12:37
I also had the chance to work with Warren once and he is the richest person in the world or he's definitely in the top five or whatever. He's also one of the most humble and down to earth guys I've ever met in my life, like surprisingly so. I think he drives like a 2004 Cadillac. Yep, he does.

Tom DiScipio
0:12:51
He's in the same car. He still lives in the same house in Oklahoma, same assistant he's had for like 45 years. There's certain things there that like fundamentally, which is why I love that quote, is that's

Tom DiScipio
0:13:00
something he would definitely say.

Tom DiScipio
0:13:02
Yeah. And so how this applies is, you know, we talked about the pullback earlier. A lot of that is because of fear, right? And so when you see the rest of the marketplace or the industry being fearful about these recessions and these pullbacks or whatever That's the time to invest. That's the time where you can actually get ahead from a marketing perspective or Any sort of growth initiative because it's during those times that as the markets pulling back many companies are pulling back in their spends

Tom DiScipio
0:13:33
Maybe it's ads, maybe it's just efforts or initiatives they're putting towards those types of things. And so be greedy when others are fearful. When the economy is pulling back or there's uncertainty or fear, it's a good chance for you to get a leg up by taking action during those times. And that's exactly what Marcus did in They Ask, You Answer in the crash of 2008 going into 2009 at the kitchen table,

Tom DiScipio
0:14:06
investing in his company's future by publishing content that was going to improve his brand's trustworthiness in a fearful market. Yeah, it happened recently too. I feel like you and Bob and the leadership team here at Impact during the COVID crisis, you did the same thing. Instead of being afraid, you guys leaned into it and went full send. And looking back retrospectively, it was the right move to make, even though it was scary, it was the right move to make. But I think to your point, so a question for you, right? We were talking about earlier

Tom DiScipio
0:14:37
about how businesses need to take risks when they're cash positive and then when there's a pullback like this to be more fundamental and conservative. How do you set yourself up because cash flow is a real thing. So if you get to a point where the economy is dipping, like you said, and people are afraid and there's fear, and to Warren's point, that's when you should buy, how do you make sure you have the cash reserves and you're set up to be able to make a move like that? Because unfortunately, some people might not have the cash or the ability

Tom DiScipio
0:15:03
to do that, and those are the people that tend to, unfortunately, not make it through some of those dips and some of those harder times. Yeah, well, for those of you listening, I did an episode on managing your marketing budget. You did. And there might be something in there about that, which is how can you adjust your budget or make it flexible enough to where you can invest in these things and prioritize them?

Tom DiScipio
0:15:25
Because it's counterintuitive. It's hey, our business is shrinking, why am I going to spend more money on growth? But that's exactly what the business needs. And so are there, you know, you think about it as a trade-off. You know, if I do this, what else can I not do? But the fact of the matter is,

Tom DiScipio
0:15:46
is that in those types of moments where you want to regain the traction that maybe you've lost, I'd argue it's either just remaining stable or going for it and investing in that growth. And that's a business decision

Tom DiScipio
0:15:59
that you're gonna have to make. Right, right. That makes sense. And it's getting strategic and thinking a little bit more long-term and being prepared for, hey, everything's great right now, but it might not be that way in a few years. So what's the longer term, the five, the 10 year? What's that plan look like? Do we have cash reserves? Do we have funds to make sure that when we do hit these tips because of the economy and because of other factors, we're ready for it and we're not just standing there

Tom DiScipio
0:16:26
going, what happened, what do we do now?

Alex Winter
0:16:28
Right, yeah, right.

Tom DiScipio
0:16:29
How does that affect marketing? So I have to ask the marketing question, right? So if we get into these pullbacks, you're talking about now's a good time to invest, people are afraid, maybe other companies are pulling back their marketing efforts,

Tom DiScipio
0:16:41
scaling down what they're doing, is that a good time to put your foot on the gas and go like, yeah, I wanna lean into marketing more? Is that part of this play? I know we're talking about the fundamentals of your business, but is it also a smart move to try to start leaning more heavily into promoting your company

Tom DiScipio
0:16:56
and or your services or your products or whatever the case may be? Yeah, I mean, I think so because so much of marketing can be noise or could be bucketed in with the word saturation, right? You reach a saturation point in a marketplace or something like that. And it's during these times where maybe companies don't choose to not or don't have the capabilities to invest in marketing

Tom DiScipio
0:17:25
when they should be. And again, those are the moments where you can actually capitalize on this lack of saturation or lack of noise and push it from your organization. So what can we say we've learned from businesses

Tom DiScipio
0:17:41
that have gotten past or gone through this sluggish economy? Yeah, there's some common threads that I hear and see with them, and a lot of it comes down to the strength of leadership. Because the strength of the leaders in the organizations

Tom DiScipio
0:17:59
disseminate through the rest of the organization. If there's a sense that there's a strong leader at the helm, the rest of the company is going to sense and want to follow through with that and support that leader. And, you know, in talking with a lot of these CEOs, I can tell, like, yes, they were forged in the fires of this stuff. And they're right. Can you tell like a CEO that survived the 08 crash versus somebody who started in like 2013 or 14 when the economy was booming again?

Tom DiScipio
0:18:32
Yeah. I mean, you can hear it and you can sense it in the decisions that they're planning to make or about to make or have made in order to get where they are today. That's fascinating. It makes sense though. When you say it, it's like, oh yeah, what's that saying? Necessity breeds invention, right? So depending on your environment, it shapes your decision making, I guess. Yeah, and I think one of the key things,

Tom DiScipio
0:18:56
like strength in leadership, goes back to our point about leaning in when others are leaning out, and not letting the fear distract you from the actual objectives that you've set as an organization.

Tom DiScipio
0:19:11
And a lot of that comes down to prioritization too, right? And taking care of your people while also looking to build a healthy company and grow the business.

Alex Winter
0:19:21
How does technology play into that?

Alex Winter
0:19:23
Yeah, I know this is a loaded question because every company uses different technology and I understand that, but just from like a high level like approach for CEOs and for leaders out there, how does that tech stack or technology play into your decision making and everything you just said?

Tom DiScipio
0:19:39
Yeah, I think from a technology side, it's all about creating efficiencies and collecting data and be able to make informed decisions off of that data and then optimize it going forward. Okay. So you've probably heard this quote, I'm sure many of our listeners have heard this quote, but what gets measured gets managed can be managed with the purpose of growth in mind. I made that last

Tom DiScipio
0:20:08
part up. Yeah, but I like it. Yes, a little extra. But I mean, we live and breathe that here at Impact. We're a data first company. We always have been as long as I've been here. And we preach that to all of our clients, too. We tell all of our clients how important that is. And it really does play in the decision making because the numbers don't lie. So you go from making decisions based off of assumptions, which could get messy,

Tom DiScipio
0:20:32
to making decisions based off of actuals. Yeah, so I get the tech side, what about the innovation side of the equation? Because there is a seesaw sort of balance that happens there with tech and with innovation, right? Yeah, yeah, so on the innovation side,

Tom DiScipio
0:20:47
when you think about it on like a global or a broad perspective, I mean, that's the driver of net new growth in the economy, right? So it's hard to say what the economy would look like today if something like AI hadn't been released to the world, like this huge, massive piece of innovation. Think about the amount of money pouring into these tech companies where you have a company like NVIDIA, who is like a big company but they've always been making graphic cards

Tom DiScipio
0:21:22
and they've been in the computer space ever since I've had computers you know and they've done they've been a decent company but there's certainly been a huge spike in the last few years just because of this AI boom. Yeah I mean a company that was relevant to a company that's the one being talked about most in the news today. I think market share wise they're even bigger than Apple today. Or they're neck and neck with each other these days which is just unbelievable.

Tom DiScipio
0:21:47
Right, right. And so you think about which one is on the leading edge of innovation right now. And listen, I'm an Apple fanboy and I always will be.

Tom DiScipio
0:21:55
Yep, same.

Alex Winter
0:21:57
No, you're not.

Tom DiScipio
0:21:58
Yeah, I love Apple.

Alex Winter
0:21:59
I know, I'm kidding.

Tom DiScipio
0:22:00
Just the phones. Here we go. Now we're letting the cat out of the bag. I have a Samsung, we're gonna hear from you.

Alex Winter
0:22:05
Ooh.

Tom DiScipio
0:22:07
Anyways, yeah, so I think the interesting part of this, though, is that innovation only gets you so far. Yeah. And at some point, innovation turns to what I'll call parity, which is, it's expected. And it's expected across everything

Tom DiScipio
0:22:28
that you experience. So AI is the most recent innovation in technology, but I would almost go as far as to say, how many of us are now currently expecting that all of the SaaS products we use have AI? I think we would say we expect every digital tool

Tom DiScipio
0:22:46
we use now to have AI in it. It's becoming parody, and it's almost like if your tool does not have this, then it will not be relevant. It's antiquated. It's antiquated.

Tom DiScipio
0:23:00
And so it goes from being innovative to antiquated really, really fast. I love what you're saying about parody, though, because I've never really heard it put that way, but that's the highest form of flattery. When someone parodies you or makes fun of you

Tom DiScipio
0:23:14
or whatever the case is, that means that you've arrived. It means you've made it, it means you're relevant and people are talking about you and then therefore they want to copy and duplicate. And that's just a recurring thing. And I think going back to the larger conversation,

Tom DiScipio
0:23:27
it plays into the whole economic piece where there are always gonna be trendy things that are happening. And as a business, you may have to keep up with those trends, but that shouldn't fundamentally change who you are as a business and it shouldn't change like

Tom DiScipio
0:23:40
the mission, the goals, the fundamentals and getting back to the roots of what we were talking about in some of these dips that tend to happen. Is that true when we're talking about innovation? Is like finding the balance of yeah this is trendy we need to do it so we don't get left in the dust but also we need to stay true to who we are. Yeah I mean innovation is our moments in time that that are sprinkled in amongst the life journey

Tom DiScipio
0:24:06
of your business, if you will. So it's always gonna be important to get back to the fundamentals and to build new things and innovate, but ultimately it's how do we get back to running an efficient and healthy company. So how does that innovation piece play

Tom DiScipio
0:24:21
into how it affects your products, your pricing? We're talking about fundamentals, but also how does that affect your bottom line, your products and your services? Yeah, I think when people think about innovation, they think about technology or things you can buy and stuff like that. But the idea here is to, you can innovate on what's happening inside your organization. You can innovate on your own processes.

Tom DiScipio
0:24:51
You can innovate on how you can reduce your time to market or build something faster or do something better. And that's the other natural course of innovation that's gonna be important for helping in specific times like this where maybe you don't have the funds to open a new department within your organization

Tom DiScipio
0:25:16
or build a new product. It's like, let's reuse those dollars to innovate on the things we already have that are successful and double down on those. I like that, I really like that. How does that play into your brand and customer loyalty?

Tom DiScipio
0:25:29
And we touched on this earlier, but I feel like it's coming back full circle with what you just said where like, how do you stay true to your roots during a changing landscape and how do you not let an economy that might be

Tom DiScipio
0:25:40
volatile or scary affect like the core of your business, which is your brand and your identity? How does one do that? I'm afraid, Tom, help me. Yeah, well, this goes back to the competition question we had earlier, which is like, hey, when it was easier to get into the marketplace, competition flourished, the CEOs I'm talking with are like, there's more competition now, it's just a common thread that I'm hearing.

Tom DiScipio
0:26:06
And so with more competition, it becomes harder to differentiate. Because a lot of times what you're executing might be exactly the same as, or what you're selling might be exactly the same as the person, the company sitting next to you.

Tom DiScipio
0:26:21
And really the key differentiator there is going to be your brand ultimately, which is not, it is a singular thing that is influenced and driven by hundreds of factors around it, right? So when it comes to differentiating in an economy where, you know, buying is more expensive and harder to win business, brand and loyalty is where the investments need to be made.

Tom DiScipio
0:26:54
And those are the factors that can override cost objections.

Alex Winter
0:26:59
Interesting, because that's where my brain goes

Alex Winter
0:27:01
is customer loyalty. And it's like, how do we keep our customers happy? How do we keep our loyal customers coming back? And for me, there has to be things done to focus on that number one over anything else.

Alex Winter
0:27:16
And I'm curious as to how you do that when the economy's down, money's tight, all these factors play into it. So we've done this before too here at Impact. Business is like riding a wave. There's highs and lows, peaks and valleys,

Tom DiScipio
0:27:29
whatever you want to call it, right? What do you guys do in those moments when you're like, we want to make sure we are putting our customers first and we're keeping it real. Yeah, I think, you know, interestingly for us at least at Impact, I'll give you the

Tom DiScipio
0:27:43
examples, figuring out other ways to allow people to enter our ecosystem that isn't the full kit and caboodle. Wow, I sound really old saying that. But you know, you take Impact Plus, our online learning community for example, free way to freeway to get in and learn about what we teach our clients, attend our events, have discussions, and begin to engage with our brand. And part of our brand is our community. And so those two things

Tom DiScipio
0:28:20
work hand in hand. And at some point, that builds trust and loyalty, which could help you upsell or grow or things like that. I would imagine that strategy in implementing these things take time and you want to make the right decision. Obviously, when there's volatility happening, you really need to slow down and really think through exactly the right plan and strategy. But once you do figure that out, how can you measure your success once we start getting into like a longer term, like 2025 and beyond, and almost trying to like,

Tom DiScipio
0:28:53
rise above some of these volatile moments in the economy or whatever pop culture moments are happening in the world. Yeah, well I think it's, at times like that, it's important to kind of point the finger back at yourself and say, am I doing everything I can as a business to set myself up for success in this type of economy. And interestingly, there are

Tom DiScipio
0:29:20
some very common things that I hear in conversations to where this is not the case. Example, I just spoke with a company that was about a hundred million plus dollars in revenue still managing sales through spreadsheets, which, hey, it's obviously gotten them to an amazing point. This comes back to the idea of technology and innovation. Can I innovate on my processes and add technology to make us

Tom DiScipio
0:29:47
more efficient so we can be more effective in a new economy? The other thing, too, is just taking a step up and out of the business and making sure you have set goals that are above and beyond any current or future economy that's going to be. So you actually have that guiding light,

Tom DiScipio
0:30:07
that thing to work towards, no matter how hard things get. And so setting a one year, setting a three year, setting a 10 year target, and simply focusing the company on achieving that mission. You know, you've heard Bob say, and I believe we might have gotten this from Tony Robbins,

Tom DiScipio
0:30:24
where focus goes, energy flows. Yes, sir. It's so true. Well, it's manifest destiny. It's the same principles of if you have a plan and you know where you want to go and you can clearly see it, you're naturally going to move that direction.

Tom DiScipio
0:30:38
Yeah. Yeah. That's really, really, really cool. You said something in there too that just really stood out to me and I hear it all the time because I'm one of these guys. I'm like the OG that's like, if it ain't broke, don't fix it kind of thing, right?

Tom DiScipio
0:30:56
But to your point with the spreadsheet situation where people are still using spreadsheets versus a new text tag, that doesn't mean that it's broken and like, oh, you don't need to fix it, but there might be a better way to do that. And just because you think that means you may not know, right? Sometimes I say it and I'm like, oh, that might have been ignorance talking there and maybe I don't really know and I just think this is the best way.

Tom DiScipio
0:31:17
So how can you also find some of those new ways of innovation or open up yourself to being aware of those things so that you're not just constantly stuck in your lane, basically? Yeah, well, that goes right back to goal setting.

Tom DiScipio
0:31:30
Yeah. Taking this organization as an example, or let's say you were a $100 million company working off of spreadsheets. Well, I think a lot of that comes down to goal setting again.

Tom DiScipio
0:31:41
Take this company example that we were just talking about. They have an objective of 2 and 1 half timesing the size of the company in five years. And so then you have to ask yourself the question, if I'm managing a sales team that's double the size that it is today, is it possible that I'm going to be able to use the same system and actually achieve the results I need to achieve?

Tom DiScipio
0:32:10
The answer is most likely no, and that should be the catalyst for change going forward. Yeah, that's really interesting. So it's two-sided where you set these goals, but then you also have to realistically say, all right, if we hit these goals, which is what we're going to try our best to do, can we operate the same way we're operating? And the answer is most likely going to be no.

Tom DiScipio
0:32:29
You can never two and a half X your company and still keep doing the same things. It's just common sense right there. That makes a lot of sense to me. Okay, so favorite part of the show. I have to ask you this. What's the one thing, if you can only pick one thing to tell business owners right now

Tom DiScipio
0:32:43
that they should be thinking about when it comes to the economy and budgets and growth going into 2025, what would you say to them? You are going to hear a lot of things in the news. You're gonna hear a lot of left things, a lot of right things, a lot of center things. And the important thing to remember

Tom DiScipio
0:33:02
is that none of us have a crystal ball. And the most important things you can lean on are how are customers perceiving your brand? Is your brand in a good spot to overcome any economical objections? And is your company aimed in the right direction so that you can still achieve what you need to achieve?

Alex Winter
0:33:21
Well said. Tom, thank you for your time and for being on the show.

Tom DiScipio
0:33:24
Yeah, man, anytime.

Alex Winter
0:33:25
We're going to be back soon. We've got more to talk about, I'm sure.

Tom DiScipio
0:33:27
Yeah.

Alex Winter
0:33:28
Yeah.

Alex Winter
0:33:29
All right.

Alex Winter
0:33:30
And for everybody out there watching and listening, this is Endless Customers.

Alex Winter
0:33:31
I'm your host, Alex Winter. I'm your host, Alex Winter. winter. Catch you on the next episode.